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My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR29/6 17:23Wed Jun 29 17:23:09 2022

Views: 1164

Just to confirm, I will be meeting with JD next week to discuss how I can help the Club technically going forward...

I am looking forward to getting involved, on a voluntary basis & I am sure that, with my experience, I can add value to the business...

Good times.

UTB.

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3 people like this 3 people

Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Camp hill reserves (Camp hill reserves)4/7 17:02Mon Jul 4 17:02:31 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 352

Perhaps they could use you filling in the ankle breakers on the approach to LW

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Lord of the Manor4/7 05:52Mon Jul 4 05:52:50 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 401

Thread ....press ignore.....

That's better ....off to wash my hair

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1 person likes this 1 person

Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By animal4/7 09:37Mon Jul 4 09:37:31 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 346

Not a bad plan otherwise you could get sucked into a circular discussion with some Luddites.
I am not a JG fan, as a football manager I rate him below Bart Simpson. His worth as a commercial manager is still unsure. To his credit he is willing to explore future possibilities and to make use of the specific skills offered by Vor.
I have to say that I am saddened to see the names of the "waste of time" posters. They cite realism. I read apathy and doom and gloom.
On an up note, Silverstone British GP was a cracker.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By The_Hullablue4/7 14:15Mon Jul 4 14:15:26 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 297

Even VoR today is warning "Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves", which is exactly what I have been suggesting his plans for EFL upgrades are.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 10:40Mon Jul 4 10:40:45 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 324

I don't think anyone is disagreeing that planning and looking at all options are needed.

Vor seems obsessed with having a ground to EFL standard. I am unaware of anyone else who sees that as a remote possibility in the medium (or long term); particularly with the current structure.

VoR does not seem to take into account finances, and how this to be achieved. If the club has to move from LW, then how the hell will it be financed?
If the club can stay at Liberty Way, then the ground is good enough for Conf-National (perhaps with minor tweeks) and his claim of 'x' years grace is disproved by some clubs at that level.

I don't think its the initiative that's being questioned, but the aims and quite frankly vastly over optimistic.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By mark-nbfc4/7 12:12Mon Jul 4 12:12:32 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 302

"If the club has to move from LW, then how the hell will it be financed?"

I do not think it would be as costly as it could be.

With a long lease or owning land, there are grants available.
Funding raising could be done to raise the other parts (effort but not unachievable).
There are movable stands at Liberty Way which may be able to be moved/used.


Could ;)

---
Hope is not a plan.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:16Mon Jul 4 12:16:03 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 299

I believe Liberty Way cost £3,500,000 and that was not starting from scratch.
Finding alternatives was impossible, and I would say even harder now.

I can only think of FCUM who effectively started from scratch and I know for fact that was not as promoted or without subsequent difficulties (hence they at Boro level with crowds of 2000+)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By mark-nbfc4/7 12:19Mon Jul 4 12:19:28 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 289

It would be a very big undertaking, but one that needs to be considered given that the lease may be nearly up at LW and there appears to be not much movement with that?

---
Hope is not a plan.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:21Mon Jul 4 12:21:23 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 303

I really don't see an acceptable/feasible solution if remaining at LW is not an option.

That could be a problem, in that the owners of liberty way are the "sellers" in a sellers market. Boro have very poor cards.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By mark-nbfc4/7 12:24Mon Jul 4 12:24:01 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 307

It has to be. There is no other alternative (VoR - if you dare say groundshare here......)

There are lots of unknown factors which you and I (& I guess nearly everyone on here) are not aware of which will impact on how feasible or not it would be.

---
Hope is not a plan.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 13:09Mon Jul 4 13:09:08 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 286

Ha! Ha!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 10:56Mon Jul 4 10:56:32 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 303

For clarity:-

Upon entry into the National, the Club is obligated to provide plans to the FA, showing how the Stadium can be upgraded to satisfy EFL membership requirements.

These are PLANS only...NOTHING MORE!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By The_Hullablue4/7 14:56Mon Jul 4 14:56:36 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 261

And according to you, after three years in the conference Premier we need to have 5,000 capacity and 2,000 seats.

Despite clubs being in that league for 10 seasons not doing so.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 14:59Mon Jul 4 14:59:42 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 256

Hulla, I have read through that section of the thread a few times, and I think VoR has conflated two different requirements by quoting so many figures in response to different people. The 5000/2000 requirement is after 3 years in EFL. The figures for National League are 4000/500, which LW meets comfortably.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 15:14Mon Jul 4 15:14:58 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 255

That is correct.

I summarised everything yesterday in detail in one of my responses.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By The_Hullablue4/7 15:24Mon Jul 4 15:24:25 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 263

And several times you said after 3 continuous seasons in the National prem we need 5,000 capacity and 2 000 seats.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By The_Hullablue4/7 15:02Mon Jul 4 15:02:29 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 261

I asked him multiple times and his is adamant.
If he has got this wrong, what else has he conflated?

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Gustavus4/7 15:16Mon Jul 4 15:16:13 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 265

I think he may have conflated being invited in for a cup of tea and a chat because he may possibly have knowledgable input and being commissioned to devise a detailed technical stadium masterplan to take the Club through the next 15 years.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:05Mon Jul 4 12:05:36 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 271

So, with perhaps minor tweaks the plans from 2019 will be available. OR even those when plans for LW were announced.

Also, you have constantly gone on about what is needed for EFL.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 12:06Mon Jul 4 12:06:42 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 270

Hopefully, that could be helpful.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By MP234/7 11:59Mon Jul 4 11:59:13 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 272

I’m actually with you on this VOR, I think having a plan in place is prudent, the difficulty at the minute would be given the lease situation on where do you base any plan.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 12:05Mon Jul 4 12:05:42 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 261

That is only one consideration MP23...leave no stone unturned!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By MJNB4/7 11:34Mon Jul 4 11:34:01 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 280

realistically, can you see us playing in the National in the near future? 2 promotions? 1 maybe, getting out of the National North I think is above us currently as a club.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 11:38Mon Jul 4 11:38:34 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 270

I think that is a realistic assessment MJ.

The intention is to go through a technical check (a senses check) of the FA's requirements & work from there...

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 11:33Mon Jul 4 11:33:29 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 263

Don't we already have those plans from when we had to present them last time we were in National?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 11:35Mon Jul 4 11:35:55 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 266

I don't know Greg but I will discuss that with JD.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Vernon Slain4/7 11:02Mon Jul 4 11:02:11 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 265

I don't know why people can't see that point. You have,to be fair,pointed this out quite a few times in the thread.

63--13--12--38--73--117= 50*/189

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 11:06Mon Jul 4 11:06:10 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 260

You can lead a horse to water Vernon!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:12Mon Jul 4 10:12:25 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 275

"with some Luddites"

Ah - the old "call anyone who disagrees a derogatory name to discredit them" approach. I am a bit disappointed - surely you are better than that?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By animal4/7 10:29Mon Jul 4 10:29:38 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 274

Not at all, Luddite is shorthand to describe those opposed to change and progress.As well you know.
I see the merit of forward planning, unrestricted by past events or probable future. You do not. You want to restrict forward planning to fit in with your "realism".
I have hope for the future and welcome having a plan in place to deal with all eventualities. You do not. You object because we have never reached the heady hights before, so why bother.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By MP234/7 12:09Mon Jul 4 12:09:08 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 251

Do agree, when we were playing in the Midland Division after Demotion under Kev Wilkin did anyone really see us being near top of National 3-4 years later !!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:19Mon Jul 4 12:19:36 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 243

Some did... I admit I was not one of them.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 13:10Mon Jul 4 13:10:52 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 256

It's a wonderful game!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:40Mon Jul 4 10:40:59 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 281

Not quite true. My view is to plan for what we can sensibly achieve in a realistic timescale. That definitely doesn't make me a Luddite (unless you are working to a different definition to the one that's normally accepted). Then, at the end of each season, look at the planning to see whether it needs to be adjusted from what we already have. That is specially applicable when we know (as acknowledged by VoR) that the FA regularly revisit requirements and make changes.

I am not saying that we should never plan for what is needed for EFL membership (unlikely though that is), just that the time to do it is not when we have just about scraped ourselves away from relegation from Step 7 and currently have no guaranteed ground stability. Maybe if we can achieve promotion from Step 6 and have a secure ground situation, that would be the time to look at the requirements in force at that time?

Also, we have actually spent a few seasons in National League - and not so long ago. Surely we must already have the submissions required at that level from last time? A few small changes to those to reflect any changes to regs and there we go!

Edit to add: As I said elsewhere in this thread - if it keeps VoR occupied for a while, then it could be a good thing regardless ;)

Edited by Greg (NBFC) at 10:49:57 on 4th July 2022

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR4/7 11:05Mon Jul 4 11:05:14 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 258

LOL.

What you have described there Greg has merit but it is only a part of the forward planning needed.

The Club has to have a forward plan that is comprehensive & deals with short/medium/long term objectives...say 5 years/10 years/15 years/& beyond.

Once the framework of that plan is set & is properly structured, then realistic timescales can be assessed to achieve those aims/ambitions.

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Something for you to watch

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 18:55Sun Jul 3 18:55:31 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 428

National league stadiums 2022/23

https://youtu.be/ikMdy5DO-vs

Dorking capacity - 3,000

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 18:57:26 on 3rd July 2022
Edited by VS Boro at 18:57:44 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Something for you to watch

By VoR3/7 19:16Sun Jul 3 19:16:03 2022In response to Something for you to watchTop of thread

Views: 384

Brilliant VS, well done...

Yes, it looks like Dorking Wanderers could have an issue, I'm sure they have plans in place to increase their capacity to 4000?...3000 is the capacity requirement for the NLN/NLS.

Maidenhead United are intending to build a new stadium.

It would be good to be going to those grounds in the future...

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Re: Something for you to watch

By 70s stalwart3/7 19:25Sun Jul 3 19:25:50 2022In response to Re: Something for you to watchTop of thread

Views: 357

In a past life I was a planning consultant down south. Housebuilders were sniffing around Maidenhead’s ground 10-15 years ago, but they couldn’t find a suitable alternative site for a ground because the town is surrounded by Green Belt. That is probably still a real sticking point.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By animal29/6 20:17Wed Jun 29 20:17:31 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 874

Persistence pays off. A good move by the club.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Jebbs29/6 20:56Wed Jun 29 20:56:39 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 832

"Let's wait and see"

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By Gustavus29/6 18:46Wed Jun 29 18:46:16 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 859

This is absolutely superb!!!

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR29/6 18:51Wed Jun 29 18:51:20 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 841

I would like to believe, as time progresses, that other people on this forum with different skills & expertise, would also step forward to help on a voluntary basis.

I am thinking here about grant applications maybe?

This is our football club & I'm sure all Boro supporters want the Boro to succeed.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By MJNB30/6 15:29Thu Jun 30 15:29:59 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 653

Fair play to you really, plenty of people say what should be done and do f**k all about it, you've put yourself out there to be shot down but stuck to your guns. If you can be a positive help to JD and JG etc etc, good on you.

I'll still take the piss though.

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR30/6 15:33Thu Jun 30 15:33:03 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 655

It's a fierce craic!

I said to Jason yesterday that I appear to be the pantomime villain! lol

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By The_Hullablue30/6 16:54Thu Jun 30 16:54:29 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 619

Oh no you don't

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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2 people like this 2 people

Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By MJNB30/6 16:42Thu Jun 30 16:42:23 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 602

Not the words I'd use but hey ho

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More the..

By Unnamed Sauce30/6 15:46Thu Jun 30 15:46:11 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 625

Pantomime Dame...?

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By almost average 229/6 18:11Wed Jun 29 18:11:43 2022In response to My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 879

I expect a 5000 capacity all seater stand and state of the art floodlights within 5 years (:
Good luck it will interesting to see how you get on .

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VS Town (VS Boro)29/6 19:21Wed Jun 29 19:21:16 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 836

What's the best way to get to Old Trafford, Anfield and Stamford Bridge........ I need to start planning.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...

By VoR29/6 18:42Wed Jun 29 18:42:53 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 843

It's a straightforward situation really AA.

The FA have a pyramid structure in place based on their rules & membership requirements.

Any member club has to mirror that in their structure, making sure that they meet the standards expected of them...

I will try to make sure that the people involved with the Boro fully understand what the FA expect technically & how that is achieved...

Yes, it should be interesting.

There is a lot more to running a successful football club than putting eleven players on the pitch at 3.00pm on a Saturday afternoon.

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Thing is...

By Unnamed Sauce29/6 21:21Wed Jun 29 21:21:51 2022In response to Re: My forthcoming involvement with the Boro...Top of thread

Views: 808

You say you hope that others "on this forum with different skills & expertise, would also step forward to help on a voluntary basis." It's a very worthy expectation. It says much of your panoramic view of things at present that you appear not to understand that many of us have in the past done this. That does not demean your enthusiasm of course,and your determination to do your bit. So you go for it.

What makes you think others haven't already done so-and been rebuffed?

In most cases, the end result, over time was the same. I'm sure some of the other forum contributors can remember some of us sitting around tables trying to explain certain financial realities to certain nameless chairpersons or directors. Spelling out the benefits that could be gained from mutual joint funding applications. That is, ones put together by supporters and shareholders/directors together. Most frequently the response was.."yeah..but when can you get us the money?" And of course without being able to prove that Fans Groups and Board were acting as one.....we couldn't.

Oh well. You are so up at the moment that I hardly dare tell you what has happened to your beloved Gallifords....

Your last sentence made me laugh out loud. Nothing personal. Just thought it sounded like Alf Tupper or Roy Race.

Edited by Unnamed Sauce at 21:22:36 on 29th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR29/6 21:44Wed Jun 29 21:44:48 2022In response to Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 747

I appreciate everything you say & I applaud everyone's past efforts.

Everything that has happened in the past, for whatever reason, has brought us to where we are now...the past has gone, we have to take stock & move on & yes, I hope with fan involvement, we have an important role to play...little steps.

It is a panoramic view because it has to be, their are so many aspects involved that all link.

It is having a good structure in place that is most important, everything flows from there...it is a process, as I am sure you well know...please don't let your past experiences put you off.

We are all Boro fans.

Edited by VoR at 21:45:52 on 29th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)29/6 22:07Wed Jun 29 22:07:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 693

How long has this iteration been in existence?

What fan involvement has there been, other than “give”?

What is the good structure?

Seems with “the past” you want to relive the good times and forget lessons that should have been learnt from the bad times

. I quote “the past is gone”, yet your projections for the future have been justified by what happened in the past.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus29/6 22:04Wed Jun 29 22:04:13 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 707

I think it’s great that you have been selected to represent Boro fans!

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR29/6 22:24Wed Jun 29 22:24:40 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 722

My involvement has nothing to do with being selected to represent the fans, it is to do with taking stock of where we are technically...in relation to the FA's rules & requirements & making sure we have the right structure in place to take the business forward technically, concerning the off-field stuff, that has to link with the on-field stuff 'just in time'.

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Re: Thing is...

By MP2330/6 06:29Thu Jun 30 06:29:36 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 667

Haven’t always seen eye to eye on here VOR but I genuinely hope you are able to help the club in this role and wish you well doing it

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus29/6 22:30Wed Jun 29 22:30:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 681

Sorry I am very pleased you have been selected to restructure the business and set strategy. Well done!

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR29/6 22:38Wed Jun 29 22:38:46 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 666

The FA's technical requirements for playing standards & spectator comforts are what will drive the business strategy.

Once the Club fully understands the varying requirements at the different levels within the pyramid, it can set its own objectives based on ambition.

That is where I can help them technically with their future planning.

Not difficult really...it just needs a clear head.

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus29/6 22:39Wed Jun 29 22:39:42 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 677

And you are the clear head!

Good luck!

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR29/6 22:48Wed Jun 29 22:48:08 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 690

No, not me!...the decision makers.

I can explain what is required & how stadium design is developed at the various levels within the pyramid & how you plan for continuing development, all in accordance with the relevant design guides & legislation...& as an aside, why we have ended up with what we have at Liberty Way.

With that knowledge, the Club can then set its own targets/plan accordingly.

Edit:

I haven't mentioned this before but it is worth mentioning now...

Promotion to the EFL League Two comes with a financial windfall.

A payment from EFL fund, a consolidation payment from the Premier League & a one-off payment from the Football Stadia Improvement Fund can add up to circa £1 million...plus the FSIF also assist with stand re-development & EFL advisors are there to help...

Plenty to do!

Edited by VoR at 00:57:24 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 08:32Thu Jun 30 08:32:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 603

[quote[Promotion to the EFL League Two comes with a financial windfall.

A payment from EFL fund, a consolidation payment from the Premier League & a one-off payment from the Football Stadia Improvement Fund can add up to circa £1 million...plus the FSIF also assist with stand re-development & EFL advisors are there to help...[/quote].

So, the club are targeting EFL? REALLY!
Is this a hint that the club are looking to build a new stadium?

I guess my reading between the lines is not accurate, but it again sounds like the club (that being JG/JD) are groping at straws with no realism/plan.

You say a "financial windfall". There are also significant costs involved.
Also, this "financial windfall" is only available after promotion.....thats at least 3 seasons away (no sniggering at the back) and vast improvements will be needed before then.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 08:41Thu Jun 30 08:41:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 636

No VS, you are flying off at a tangent!

Any football club, not only the Boro, need to appreciate & understand how the Pyramid works, before it can set its own goals/targets/aspirations.

Take Morecambe as an example.

They have realistically achieved their aims by playing in League One.

To go any higher & to play in the Championship, they would have to transition to a minimum 5000-all seater stadium.

Once a club knows the parameters, they can set their own ambitions & work accordingly.

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Re: Thing is...

By MP238/7 15:45Fri Jul 8 15:45:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 173

I don’t remember Yeovil doing that when they played in the Championship !

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR8/7 17:09Fri Jul 8 17:09:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 112

By the start of the fourth season of continuous membership of the Championship, standing terraces can no longer be used, so the member Club has to transition to a minimum 5000-capacity all-seater Stadium.

Perhaps Yeovil Town didn't anticipate staying that long?

The same applies to Burton Albion, although I believe they have a planning application pending to further develop their Stadium.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 08:54Thu Jun 30 08:54:01 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 609

Any football club, not only the Boro, need to appreciate & understand how the Pyramid works, before it can set its own goals/targets/aspirations.

I totally agree, but with an owner who has been at this level for decades, who then appointed a chairman to run the club 2+ years ago (who has hinted at a new ground and has a five-year plan) I would have assumed this understanding would be in place by now.

So, we have a chairman and owners who do not appreciate & understand the pyramid. And people wonder why I see the club as a junior setup that also has a first team.

Let's take Barnet, Yeovil, Macclesfield or Scarborough as examples?

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)30/6 09:36Thu Jun 30 09:36:14 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 590

I think it's fair to say that I have not always been the biggest fan of VoR's contributions on here, but ...

Maybe the club has recognised a gap in its knowledge and has identified VoR as someone who may be able to offer a solution to that gap, hopefully FOC. That surely has to be a good thing?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 09:46Thu Jun 30 09:46:55 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 607

Greg, I have made it clear to the Club that I can only offer an opinion.

I am retired & as such closed my business down upon my retirement.

I can outline the options available to the Club for their consideration but beyond that they will have to employ Consultants to take forward any actions arising...

I am happy to spend time with them FOC, after the negative experience of the pandemic. I am a Boro fan & it will give me a boost, hopefully trying to use my time productively & it will do me good health wise to have an involvement.

I'm very much looking forward to it!

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 09:42Thu Jun 30 09:42:33 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 601

I don't disagree, just find it surprising (okay, perhaps not) that its taken the club this long given everything that's known about the ground situation.

StadiaSafe managed, and I believe the process of 4G at Barwell started during JG tenure.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By mark-nbfc30/6 12:43Thu Jun 30 12:43:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 574

I think you may be reading too much into the clubs position based on VoR's post and what JD said a few months ago in the Youtube interview.

---
Hope is not a plan.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 13:07Thu Jun 30 13:07:14 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 575

Maybe so.

But the ground situation is known; JD said a lot, including a move and five year plan.

I appreciate it’s worth exploring every avenue BUT I would have expected knowledge of requirements to be high up on the agenda of any club.

IMO opinion a move to a new stadium is a pipe dream so somehow sorting out something with liberty way owners is paramount. If this can be done any improvements to LW would be minimum (unless FL comes knocking 🤪🤪🤪 and I suspect most would laugh at National coming knocking)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By joetowny (Joe)30/6 16:18Thu Jun 30 16:18:29 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 557

fwiw i believe the club ARE looking to re locate
when or how this will /can be achieved i have absolutely no idea.
a pipe dream ? again who knows at this moment in time.
looking back over its history
Coton rd
the old showground ( behind asda )
Manor Park
Liberty Way
any more come to mind ? its a sorry state of affairs all round
even the "showground " one season going full time playing to a packed stadium... result BUST.
manor park the jewel in the crown ...... same story fucked up ( sorry about the language )
LW we all know how we came to go there.... and the reasons for buying it shameful
some people reading this know where im coming from SHAME on you all involved.
for all Jimmy's faults on the playing side, off the field matters are probably being run as well as at any time
adding you dont have to be exactly a successful mogul to beat previous efforts and cock ups
to put into context if i had ran my house to the same standards since the sixties
i would be in a one room council bedsit now.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 16:40Thu Jun 30 16:40:39 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 537

Greenmoor Road
Bermuda.
Different area of Liberty Way.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By MJNB30/6 16:41Thu Jun 30 16:41:47 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 540

Definitely should have been built at The Jubilee/Greenmoor Road.

The meeting with the local residents (myself included) was brilliant fun.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 16:46Thu Jun 30 16:46:12 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 534

Sadly, my father had moved before that BUT I do remember the "outrage" of some when the Jubilee was built (not my father I add). I also recall a neighbour (who went to the Boro') complaining about the PA system (when at his home......and YES.....it used to work)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By mark-nbfc30/6 14:35Thu Jun 30 14:35:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 570

" BUT I would have expected knowledge of requirements to be high up on the agenda of any club."

How do you know that they are not already? VoR might be supporting with this but that doesnt mean that work has not already been done?

---
Hope is not a plan.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 16:04Thu Jun 30 16:04:49 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 560

I don't know, but given VoR stated "job description" it sounded like it was needed. If already in-place, then so-be-it.

From what I have read from VoR is, whilst he has some experience on this matter all he has done is sit and read the regulations

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 16:33:45 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 17:00Thu Jun 30 17:00:15 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 525

Straight red!

3-match ban.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 17:06Thu Jun 30 17:06:13 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 526

Can I have a season ban please.

Years ago I got a 4 match ban (totally wrong. Ref was a club mate and wanted to show impartiality when thing became out-of-hand).

I appealed. At hearing (chaired by other club mates) they read a letter from a team mate asking them to increase it to 8 games!!!!! Sadly for Doug, they squashed the ban :) :)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 09:03Thu Jun 30 09:03:08 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 600

No VS, you are making the wrong presumption.

They want to 'fully' understand the technical aspects.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal30/6 08:47Thu Jun 30 08:47:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 609

Any football club, not only the Boro, need to appreciate & understand how the Pyramid works, before it can set its own goals/targets/aspirations.

^^^^^^^^^ this
To paraphrase " Hope is not a plan"

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 08:56Thu Jun 30 08:56:19 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 589

bollocks..... "Hope is not a plan" sums things up. Why didn't I say that.

Have you a simple phrase for "just because you say something will happen, it does not mean it will happen".

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By animal30/6 08:59Thu Jun 30 08:59:41 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 599

Shamelessly purloined from a poster on here.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By mark-nbfc30/6 12:28Thu Jun 30 12:28:50 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 569

From a piece of graffiti on a house wall after Hurricane Katrina

---
Hope is not a plan.

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1 person likes this 1 person

Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)30/6 08:39Thu Jun 30 08:39:59 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 595

... that's at least 3 seasons lifetimes away ...

I fixed it for you.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue30/6 07:39Thu Jun 30 07:39:48 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 611

Just wanted to clarify.
How many actual stadiums have you designed?

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 08:04Thu Jun 30 08:04:08 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 603

I am not a designer, I am a Major Projects Estimator with a background as a Quantity Surveyor, with extensive experience in Design & Build projects.

I worked within a tender team. My responsiblity was to produce the best net cost estimate for the project, so the other team members reported to me, so I know the benefits of good, effective teamwork...I understand design development & value engineering...also, the necessity for accurate cost planning.

I have been involved with Worcester City & Chesterfield, working in conjunction with Reidsteel, with assistance from Hewitt Sportsturf, producing detailed cost plans.

I was the Estimator on the re-build of the Trinity Road Stand at Villa Park for Aston Villa, when working for Galliford.

I submitted the lowest tender on the Caterpillar Stand at Welford Road for Leicester Tigers, when working for Sisk, where we also submitted a price for an alternative roof design.

They are the significant projects.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue30/6 08:46Thu Jun 30 08:46:39 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 605

So none then.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal30/6 09:05Thu Jun 30 09:05:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 598

I would bet good money that he knows some that have though.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 08:59Thu Jun 30 08:59:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 596

Stadium design is very straightforward.

The 'Green Guide' is the design manual, coupled with the relevant safety legislation.

A Main Stand is essentially structural steelwork, precast concrete & metal cladding...all this can be designed & constructed by an experienced design & build sub-contractor.

The remainder comprises masonry & a fit-out contract...plus seats & usually the installation of a lift.

Nothing too stressful.

The key component is the appointment of a competent Architect, who understands the application of the 'Green Guide', supplemented by a Structural Engineer & an M & E Services Engineer.

The rest is just a process.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 09:02Thu Jun 30 09:02:42 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 600

You have missed a very minor point........ £££££££££££££££s

How on earth was Liberty Way built without you ;)

I just find it amazing that the club NOW have picked you (from post on a forum) to advise on things that are available and a club that probably should be level 6 does not know.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By bert's dad30/6 17:05Thu Jun 30 17:05:14 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 522

You could also be asking why on earth was Liberated Way allowed to be built in the way it was.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 17:22Thu Jun 30 17:22:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 537

It does defy all normal convention.

It is the reverse of what you would expect.

The Main Stand is usually the priority, the main feature & everything else follows on from there!

The Stadium should have been designed & built to National League requirements, with the ability to increase the facilities to EFL requirements at the appropriate time but LW has a capacity in excess of NL requirements...a jumbled up logic!?

That said, what we have is more than acceptable, the project just needs completing...

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 17:39Thu Jun 30 17:39:36 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 536

Maybe so.

I may have more sympathy for StadiaSafe than many others, irrespective the ground was built to what could be afforded*

I appreciate no stand existed initially (and the one we got was "on the cheap", but the ground (with a few other adjustments) proved to be adequate for Level 5. To improve for EFL would have cost a few bob BUT if Boro' ever in that position more than a few bob would have been spent.

if the club have asked you to help get things ready for EFL I dispair - No way will this iteration of the club get anywhere near that.

* what and why this was is another matter.

Again - How/why should the football club spend serious money on the ground when it does not own it, and could quite possibly not be playing on it soon.
Again - Where does the money come from to build a new stadium to standards you demand?


I am really struggling to think of a club that has built a stadium from scratch at a different location without either massive investors (and still struggling) OR a ground to sell.
The only one is FCUM and believe me; there is more than meets the eye there.

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 17:41:43 on 30th June 2022
Edited by VS Boro at 17:43:52 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue30/6 18:04Thu Jun 30 18:04:50 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 528

I think you are conflating what VoR is saying with full on reality.
Never do that.

I do not think the club have asked a bloke off the Internet to help them get Liberty Way up to EFL standards no more than Usain Bolt's parents taught him to sprint really fast when he was still in utero.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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1 person likes this 1 person

Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 17:49Thu Jun 30 17:49:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 548

Forget this notion VS about preparing the Stadium for the EFL.

If that time ever comes (never say never), the Boro will get a windfall payment(s) from various sources & they will have a grace period to build the New Main Stand upon entry to League Two, so don't get too hung up on that one...

The best option by far for the Boro is to remain at LW with a 10-year rolling lease, anything else will be a serious challenge.

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 11:13Sun Jul 3 11:13:01 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 409

"Forget this notion VS about preparing the Stadium for the EFL."

VoR - am I reading that correctly? Ever since your first post on here you have been banging on about us needing extra stand space and better floodlights ready for when we are promoted to EFL - and now you're saying we should forget that notion? Really?

At least you seem to be taking the first step toward reality! :)

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2 people like this 2 people

Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 11:29Sun Jul 3 11:29:24 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 409

You are reading my comment out of context.

I was replying to VS's post.

There has to be an overview of the FA's technical requirements for a club of the Boro's stature, that takes them progressively from Level/Step 10 (the Griff's league) right through & up to Level/Step 3 (EFL League One) to make the club 'future-proof'...looking 10/20/30 years ahead, however long it takes under however many ownerships?

A poor decision made now could impact adversely on the future ambitions of the club.

...that said, yes, I would like to see the Boro playing in the EFL in my lifetime.

I still believe that the National will eventually become EFL League Three at some point...that pressure will come from the clubs.

There were SIX clubs in the National last season with average attendances between 5k-10k.

Two of those clubs, Stockport County & Grimsby Town have been promoted, to be replaced by Oldham Athletic & Scunthorpe United.

The FA need to be mindful that by continually working hard building the Pyramid from the bottom up, that they don't create a frustrating log-jam between the National & EFL League Two.

These are just my thoughts but that said, the Boro need to keep their wits about them at all times...

The fans will be unforgiving otherwise...

Edited by VoR at 11:37:33 on 3rd July 2022
Edited by VoR at 11:51:02 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:12Sun Jul 3 12:12:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 384

Once more, that had nothing to do with thenpost you were replying to.
You do that all the time.
Yiu say at the end of your post that the EFL must be careful not to create a logjam between national league and league two.
The national league needs to be careful it doesn't create one further down too.
For now Boro would be foolish to do any work making LW better (we need to work to maintain it though) until we get a new 10nyear rolling lease.
Mo lease, no work.
It would be throwing money away.
LW is good enough for our needs in the foreseeable future. It doesn't need anything added.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 12:28Sun Jul 3 12:28:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 381

I totally agree Hulla, all we need to do is to plan for it...the FA require to see the plans at the appropriate time.

The FA Handbook provides the governance for all member clubs.

It order to develop their specific requirements for the NLS, they consulted with all of the leagues, to produce their ground grading requirements for each Level/Step.

Security of Tenure is a requirement at every level of the NLS.

The FA Handbook (in the absence of ground ownership) requires a lease/letter of acceptance to be in place for the following season, confirmed in writing by 31st March in each ensuing year...these are standardised rules.

The specific rules for membership of the National League enhance that requirement, stating that a '10-year rolling lease' is required for membership of the EFL.

The EFL rules for membership repeat the FA's standardised rules.

Every league agrees to abide by the FA's rules...the FA are the governing body.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:36Sun Jul 3 12:36:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 383

Wow all of that reply and only one line was relevant to my reply, and even then seeming to contradict itself in that one sentence.

We do not need to plan for pro.otiom to the EFL.
Not even a little bit.

We do not need to plan for any ground improvements. Not a single one

If we get a long term secure tenancy we can think about ground improvements .
If we get a good team in the Alliance Prem after that, we can think about those things then.

Now, we need to sort out long-term security for our home, be it at LW or elsewhere.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 15:14Sun Jul 3 15:14:40 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 350

And …. If EFL becomes a reality for boro that will be because someone has spend £100,000s of even millions in getting the team and structure ready. Given that, the person would surely have the money to make appropriate improvements to the ground.

VOR said all clubs must show plans for EFL membership - let’s steal Barwells or needham Markets

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 15:51Sun Jul 3 15:51:15 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 337

Money will need to be invested in building the team but the cost of the work to complete the Stadium project would attract funding from the EFL & other sources...once in the EFL the Club will receiving funds annually from the EFL.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 17:08Sun Jul 3 17:08:58 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 325

At least not chicken and egg

When in FL those funds won’t be needed as ground up to Fl

How is this evolution going to start?

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 17:27Sun Jul 3 17:27:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 328

When a club is promoted to League Two, they are given until 30th April in their first season to increase their capacity to 5000, including 1000 seats.

The club will be given funding, on admission from various sources, so the new Main Stand can be built during the first season & not beforehand...

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:03Sun Jul 3 13:03:16 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 371

Security of tenure is paramount.

We cannot wait to plan for stadium improvements, because raising the finance, obtaining planning permission & carrying out the building work will take a significant amount of time...there are always Planning delays...NBBC have other consultees to consider in their process.

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 14:52Sun Jul 3 14:52:22 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

You do realise, VoR, that your reply did not actually address any of the questions I asked - it was just another statement of what you keep saying?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:06Sun Jul 3 13:06:35 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 359

We can wait to plan for things that are not needed.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:14Sun Jul 3 13:14:48 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 388

The planning not only applies to LW but to any other site that we may occupy in the future.

It is just that we are way ahead of the game at LW...miles ahead!

We could ultimately end up with a 6000 capacity stadium, including 2000 seats & the Home End, the Away End & the Rugby Club terrace will remain intact...as is!

With careful financial planning, the New Main Stand would br paid for essentially from EFL funding/other grants.

That said, if we have to leave LW for another site, we will be starting from scratch & that will be very challenging...not insurmountable but very challenging!?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:17Sun Jul 3 13:17:06 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 364

Yeah, two very very projects.

May be worth holding off on thosemplans before we know what we need to plan.

Either way, we are not going to need to worry about League Two membership for a long time, if ever.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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When was the first Nuneaton football team?

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 15:26Sun Jul 3 15:26:29 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 381

Because since then the FL has not been achieved BUT now we need to be ready for it in 3 or 4 years and IMO it’s going to be far harder now than in the past (without serious money)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 12:52Sun Jul 3 12:52:21 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 381

I am a little concerned that you do not see any need to plan for anything.
Planning costs nothing, it gives you an overview of the issues in the way to achieving your aims and you can then find ways to remove those issues.
As I said before, makes perfect sense to me.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 14:54Sun Jul 3 14:54:55 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

I may wish to take issue with "planning costs nothing". Asking someone with good google skills to rustle up a few numbers costs nothing. Just ask the likes of Spurs how much planning a new stadium costs.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:13Sun Jul 3 22:13:12 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 278

But.....VoR is giving his time and experience for free.
Maybe for the sake of accuracy, planning costs nothing compared to not planning.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 15:00Sun Jul 3 15:00:15 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 358

Planning costs for a new stadium will be substantial.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:13Sun Jul 3 22:13:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 284

But.....planning for the future will not.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 22:23Sun Jul 3 22:23:35 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 288

Exactly.

We need to carry out an extensive technical 'senses check', leaving no stone unturned, so that we can be well prepared for any potential future scenario.

That will cost nothing...just time & application & the will to go through the process but at the end of it all, it will be well worth the effort.

Edited by VoR at 22:47:38 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 22:42Sun Jul 3 22:42:42 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 291

The original plans for liberty outlined expansion and how the ground would be completed in phases

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 22:57Sun Jul 3 22:57:40 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 291

We have to start from what we have now & work from there...look at the options we have for developing the far side of the ground & how many phases that will need, to match up with the funds available...there is plenty of scope to do that, to suit JG's business plans, if we stay at LW.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 23:04Sun Jul 3 23:04:11 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 293

We need to start by knowing if we can stay at LW.
Lots of things point to us not doing so.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 23:12Sun Jul 3 23:12:29 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 310

One of the major factors will be whether JG thinks it's financially viable/feasible to do so?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue4/7 07:09Mon Jul 4 07:09:18 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 312

I am not sure he will even have that choice.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 09:18Mon Jul 4 09:18:07 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 259

Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves.

I am meeting Jason on Wednesday.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue4/7 14:13Mon Jul 4 14:13:50 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 225

Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves

Says the poster talking about getting the ground ready for EFL.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 14:24Mon Jul 4 14:24:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 231

Unless/until we are told otherwise, that is the logical next step to plan for with the Stadium at LW.

Simples!

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue4/7 14:57Mon Jul 4 14:57:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 213

It is neither logical or simple to do so.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:57Sun Jul 3 12:57:16 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 385

Why plan to improve LW when we have no future there at the moment?

And planning foes cost.
It costs time and energy that can be used better elsewhere, and it uses resources that could be better used elsewhere.
Every minute our owners spend thinking about promotion to the EFL is a mi use that could be spent thinking about realistic targets.

Boro need to plan what it will do to solve the ground issue.
No point planning to improve LW if we will not be here by 2028-29 season.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 15:17Sun Jul 3 15:17:19 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 350

Poole Town spent loads in getting the county ground up to SL standards only to be kicked off after 2 or 3 years

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:15Sun Jul 3 22:15:42 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 290

Not sure what your point is? Avoid any planning and improvement in case we get relegated i/when we gain promotion?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 22:19Sun Jul 3 22:19:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 277

He wasn't talking about relegation but about being made to leave a ground they do not own.
Why should Boro plan to spend money improving a ground it doesn't own?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:22Sun Jul 3 22:22:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 290

Dont think that anyone has suggested that. We all agree that we would need assured tenure before spending money on improvements.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 22:28Sun Jul 3 22:28:46 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 279

He keeps talking about the improvements needed to LW to join National League.
He talks about the improvements we will need to make to LW (a ground we do not own) to get into the EFL (a league we have never been close to joining).
This is literally what he has been posting about since the day he joined.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:34Sun Jul 3 22:34:04 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 302

I have read his posts as assuming we get tenure at LW, and yes, I know we don't have it yet, if ever.
He has also said several times that the criteria for progressing up the pyramid are the same whether we stay at LW or find another home.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:01Sun Jul 3 13:01:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 373

You do realise that you are making mine and Vors point, don't you?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:06Sun Jul 3 13:06:01 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 358

If I am, you and VoR are making your points very poorly as they seem very different to mine.

You seem to be talking about planning to get LibertyWay up to EFL standards (which would involved building a new stand) when we do not know if we will be at Liberty Way in five seasons.

We may as well start planning for Champions League winning tours around Nuneaton as that is as realistic in the short term as winning promotion to the EFL (neither are realistic).

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:11Sun Jul 3 13:11:11 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 363

If I am, you and VoR are making your points very poorly as they seem very different to mine.

We are talking about PLANNING. You are talking about actually doing work to improve LW.

You seem to be talking about planning to get LibertyWay up to EFL standards (which would involved building a new stand) when we do not know if we will be at Liberty Way in five seasons.


Planning does not commit you to anything.

We may as well start planning for Champions League winning tours around Nuneaton as that is as realistic in the short term as winning promotion to the EFL (neither are realistic).

Desperate, Hulla, desperate.Who mentioned "short term"?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:15Sun Jul 3 13:15:54 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 357

No, I am also talking about planning.

There is no point in planning to do anything at LW until we know we will be staying.
The time and effort and resources can be better used elsewhere.

And I am talking about short term, I have always been talking about short term in this conversation, hence me saying the first focus in getting secured tenancy.

once that is done, we can start thinking long term.

I think Boro moving out of LW is far more realistic than Boro getting promoted to the EFL.

If I was in charge, all of the off-field planning would be focused on securing a long-term home for the club.

Once that is done, then we can look at our rise to the Championship and derbies with Cov.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:29Sun Jul 3 13:29:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 375

Now we are on the same page Hulla.

The planning, whether it is at LW or at another site, has to flow.

It has to potentially consider a rise from Level/Step 10 up to Level/Step 3.

Morecambe are a good example of what can be achieved.

The planning process has to consider the increase in technical requirements as you move from level to level in the Pyramid...you have to plan ahead carefully in considering the Stadium design to avoid mistakes & wasting money...it cannot be done in a series of jerks!...it has to FLOW!

You are absolutely right Hulla, the main priority is security of tenure...a key requirement for the FA at all levels of membership.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:31Sun Jul 3 13:31:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 354

We are on the same first line of a page.
The rest of the text is very different.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:38Sun Jul 3 13:38:00 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 362

Once we meet the requirements for membership of the EFL League Two, we also meet the requirements for membership of the EFL League One...

Simples!

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 15:03Sun Jul 3 15:03:26 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 338

To complete that statement, once we meet the requirements for Premier league, by definition we meet the requirements for every league below - and also for European competition. Now I'm sure you would agree that - while it's not impossible for us to reach the Premier League in the next 10 years - it's vanishingly unlikely that we will ever need a stadium that good.

As we have never been above National League in the entire history of the club, and even following the 5 year plan for EFL membership we are now lower in the pyramid than when that plan started, where is the justification or evidence that we will need a stadium better than we have in the foreseeable future? No-one - even the most optimistic Boro fan - has ever actually shown a realistic plan to take us above National League. Why plan for something that is extremely unlikely to happen? Or if you think we do need to plan for the unlikely, why not plan for Premier League and Europe?

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 17:04Sun Jul 3 17:04:01 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 321

We have a ground good enough to play in Europe 🤪🤪

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 15:46Sun Jul 3 15:46:22 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

I will clarify the position:-

When we are promoted to the National League, it is incumbent on the Club to provide plans to the FA to demonstrate our ability to become a member of the EFL.

There are 3 stages of membership criteria to be met:-

1...Demonstrate the ability to achieve a 5000 capacity, including 1000 seats...the feasibility.

2...Increase the Stadium capacity in line with (1).

3...Increase the Stadium seating capacity to 2000 seats by the end of three years of continuous membership.

Once all of this has been achieved, LW (or any other future home) will allow the Boro to play in League One & League Two.

The Premier League & the Championship currently require all-seater Stadiums.

So, League One is the highest level we could play at realistically...the height of our ambition.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:32Sun Jul 3 19:32:22 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 341

I may be getting confused, but are you saying that after three seasons on the trot in the conference Premier a ground needs to be minimum 5,000 capacity and 2.000 seats?

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

Edited by The_Hullablue at 19:44:21 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 19:51Sun Jul 3 19:51:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 293

I think I can see where you are going with this 😉

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 19:40Sun Jul 3 19:40:33 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 313

5000 capacity including 2000 seats, by the end of the third year of continuous membership.

That's after the National League ground has been upgraded to 5000 capacity including 1000 seats by 30th April of the first year in the EFL.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:43Sun Jul 3 19:43:35 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 311

So a lower requirement for first year in EFL than 3rd year in conference?

Are you sure?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 20:03Sun Jul 3 20:03:12 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 302

National League...capacity 4000 including 500 seats.

EFL League Two (by end of year 1)...capacity 5000 including 1000 seats.

EFL League Two (by end of Year 3)...capacity 5000 including 2000 seats.

It is possible to just develop 3 sides of the ground & leave one side unused...Kassam Stadium, Oxford United.

It's all very flexible.

At LW we would build a new 500-seater Main Stand & leave the existing 500-seater stand in place to increase the seating capacity to 1000 seats..(by end of year 1).

We would then either sell or demolish the existing 500-seater stand & build two extentions to the new stand, one either side to increase the seating capacity to 2000 seats...(by end of year 3).

The capacity of the Home End is circa 1800...(leave intact).

The capacity of the Away End is circa 900...(leave intact).

The capacity of the Rugby Club Terrace is circa 1300...(leave intact).

Stadium capacity...6000...(exceeds the 5000 minimum requirement)...no problem.

The capacity of the Away End...900 equates to 15% of the Stadium capacity (the requirement for FA Cup matches)...perfect.

Job done!

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 20:06Sun Jul 3 20:06:38 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 306

Previously you have said after three years in NLP the capacity had to be 5 000 with 2,000 seats.
Can you please make your mind up.


And, once more,it looks massively unlikely Boro will be at LW beyond 2028-29 season, so your plan uou laid out is flawed and useless.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 20:08Sun Jul 3 20:08:21 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 298

I meant 5000 including 2000 seats...sorry!

It's all good stuff!

Plenty to think about!

Edited by VoR at 20:09:06 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 09:43Mon Jul 4 09:43:20 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 249

But surely that's what's needed after 3 years in EFL div 2 - not National League? You are throwing around so many numbers that you are even confusing yourself!

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 10:00Mon Jul 4 10:00:20 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 248

It's all about an overview of the FA's technical requirements.

As far as the Boro are concerned that range is from Level/Step 10 (the Griff's league) up to Level/Step 3 (EFL League One)...that will dictate future Stadium planning, in whatever circumstances...

It's not about 'we have never been there & most likely never will & so just be realistic & forget about it'...it is about compliance & putting a structure in place to enable the Club to plan ahead with confidence, across that range.

I hope that helps?

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:10Mon Jul 4 10:10:07 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 247

You do realise that your post there did not even come close to being relevant to what I said, don't you?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 20:09Sun Jul 3 20:09:31 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 301

How long have Boreham Wood been in the National League?


Edit to change "national north" to "national league" correcting an error caused by lack of concentration.

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Edited by The_Hullablue at 20:15:58 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 20:10Sun Jul 3 20:10:36 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 308

Boreham Wood are in the National.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 20:13Sun Jul 3 20:13:48 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 338

I know, sorry, that was me not concentrating.

You have said after 3 years in the National a club needs 5,000 capacity and 2 000 seats.
Several times.

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Edited by The_Hullablue at 20:14:42 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 19:54Sun Jul 3 19:54:17 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 296

So, relegation under daish/Reid was a formality as would have been kicked out 😉

Unless regs changed, and I somehow doubt that.
I think Wealdstone been at that level 3 seasons….. covid interrupted I admit

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:57Sun Jul 3 19:57:29 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 298

Look at Boreham Wood (who play in Borehamwood)

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 17:07Sun Jul 3 17:07:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 317

) will allow the Boro to play in League One & League Two.

Bit short signed. Once I FL it’s only two promotions away (as opposed to 3 promotions needed for FL)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 16:13Sun Jul 3 16:13:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 338

"So, League One is the highest level we could play at realistically"

That's where you and reality appear to be travelling in opposite directions. Realistically, with a tail wind and travelling downhill, we may manage to hold our own in National League for a few seasons. Surely even you can see that history demonstrates that quite clearly? So why not just plan for that as a remote possibility and forget EFL completely until a multi-millionaire starts pumping cash in - because that's what an EFL pipedream will need as its starting point?

Edited by Greg (NBFC) at 16:50:48 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 16:37Sun Jul 3 16:37:09 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 328

It's about 'future-proofing' the Boro...putting in place a structure to carry the Club forward for the next 20/30/40 years, with however many owners are involved in the future.

It's nothing to do with me, I am just trying to ensure that we all properly understand the FA's intentions in building & continuing to build the Pyramid.

You can set your own level.

LW is capable of transitioning to the EFL without too much fuss...it is a real asset.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 17:32Sun Jul 3 17:32:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 312

It is not our asset

And that is the entire issue.

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Edited by The_Hullablue at 17:32:34 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 17:37Sun Jul 3 17:37:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 327

That is a private matter.

I am only interested in the technical stuff, that's what is common to any ground/stadium/site at all levels in the Pyramid...that is my focus...the design principles remain the same & can be applied to any situation.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 17:54Sun Jul 3 17:54:44 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 304

It is not a private matter.

It is THE central plank of everything we need to do.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 17:12Sun Jul 3 17:12:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 329

LW is capable of transitioning to the EFL without too much fuss...it is a real assets

But the football club don’t own that asset.

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 17:13:20 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 17:32Sun Jul 3 17:32:00 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 310

A secure long-term lease is acceptable.

Coventry Rugby Club are pushing ahead with their Stadium development plans at the Butts Park Arena...they have a secure long-term lease in place with the landowner Coventry City Council.

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus3/7 18:39Sun Jul 3 18:39:15 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 309

A secure long term lease isn’t on offer and won’t be on offer.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 18:44Sun Jul 3 18:44:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 293

There are more than one possible landlords. Long-term lease may be possible elsewhere.

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus3/7 18:45Sun Jul 3 18:45:26 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 306

Yes that’s true.

I thought he was saying liberty way was an asset etc

Far better to be realistic IMO

Edited by Gustavus at 18:45:43 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:20Sun Jul 3 19:20:44 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 295

He was saying it is.

He is wrong about that.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 19:35Sun Jul 3 19:35:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 301

I am only referring to its technical merit.

I have to assume a secure long-term lease is available...FA Standardised Rule 2.3.2 applies, followed up by the FA's more specific rules for membership of the National League...10-year rolling lease required for membership of the EFL.

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 09:47Mon Jul 4 09:47:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 237

As we are not members of EFL and - if history is any kind of yardstick - are never likely to be, that point is worthless. Have we been here before? I believe we have ;)

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:37Sun Jul 3 19:37:32 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 302

Why do you have to assume?

And why do you have to assume the opposite of what everyone else believes to be true?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 19:45Sun Jul 3 19:45:17 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 295

Because the logic applies to any potential future Stadium, not just LW.

The physical site conditions elsewhere may differ to LW but the design logic remains the same, with possible variations on a theme...it's very straightforward.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 19:47Sun Jul 3 19:47:40 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 290

Our ground is LW.
We do not have that long-term tenancy there.

Therefore all plans based on the assumption we do are beyond worthless.

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus3/7 19:37Sun Jul 3 19:37:19 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 303

You are better off assuming it isn’t on offer!

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1 person likes this 1 person

Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 17:33Sun Jul 3 17:33:31 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 309

We do not have a secure long term lease.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:45Sun Jul 3 13:45:00 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 355

We do not need to do that.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:22Sun Jul 3 13:22:23 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 355

If I was in charge, all of the off-field planning would be focused on securing a long-term home for the club.

That is also a part of planning.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:23Sun Jul 3 13:23:42 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 346

I know that is part of planning, and that is the planning I would be doing , not getting ready to gain entry to a league we have never been close to joining.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:28Sun Jul 3 13:28:06 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

Nobody is saying that we should be getting ready for greatness, but we should at least have a plan in place if/when it happens so that we are prepared. Waiting is the kiss of death to progress.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:30Sun Jul 3 13:30:13 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 346

VoR is repeatedly saying we need to get ready for joint EFL.

We need to get ready for that like I need to get ready for my marriage to Meghan Markel.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:35Sun Jul 3 13:35:23 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 347

No Hulla!

We need to PLAN for it!

Once we enter the National, there is an expectation from the FA that you are there with serious intent to gain promotion to the EFL.

That is the whole purpose behind the creation of the NLS.

The end of the 'Football League closed shop'.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:43Sun Jul 3 13:43:54 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 355

We do not need to plan for it in the summer of 2022.

There are lots of other things we need to PLAN for before we even get anywhere near joining a league we have never come close to joining.

We do not need to plan for making Boro kits with six sleeves for when we have an alien playing as a false number 10.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:34Sun Jul 3 13:34:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 356

VoR is repeatedly saying we need to get ready for joint EF in the future.

FTFY.

We need to get ready for that like I need to get ready for my marriage to Meghan Markel

EFL is more likely, and more desirable I think that you will agree!

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:41Sun Jul 3 13:41:43 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 351

The are equally likely IMO.
That is why I said it.
And equally desirable.

As for first quote, sorry but fat thumbs and other stuff leads to typos.

It should read: "VoR is repeatedly saying we need to get ready for joining the EFL in the future"

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:46Sun Jul 3 13:46:59 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

You now really worry me if you think that MM is desirable! Steak at home and you desire hamburger?
As for the quote, it was not your fat fingers I fixed, I just added "in the future" for you.

Have to leave now, Silverstone started.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 12:01Sun Jul 3 12:01:07 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 375

So, in summary you are saying boro need a ground suitable for the EFL, which may in future include the conference

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 12:14Sun Jul 3 12:14:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 367

The FA are progressively building & strengthening the NLS.

You have to keep your eye on what they are doing...

They are continually reviewing the ground grading requirements at all levels & they publish amendments at regular intervals.

The Boro are well advanced in the ground grading process at LW...it is a stadium that is currently in excess of National League requirements.

So, yes LW is a very good facility, ready to make the transition to the EFL, if/when the time comes?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:17Sun Jul 3 12:17:28 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 365

The Boro are well advanced in the ground grading process at LW...it is a stadium that is currently in excess of National League requirements.

So, yes LW is a very good facility, ready to make the transition to the EFL, if/when the time comes?



So for the foreseeable future, the ground is fine.
We do not need to improve it unless the football league comes calling and there is no point doing it unless we have a longer more secure tenancy.

Seems right there we have two more pressing issues to address before we even need to think about adding anything to Liberty Way.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 12:30Sun Jul 3 12:30:49 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 357

Once again Hulla, I totally agree...we just need to plan for it...

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 12:41Sun Jul 3 12:41:41 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 365

VoR - let's get this straight. The FA are constantly reviewing their requirements and sometimes update them. We are not currently even close to achieving promotion to EFL - in my opinion (and that of many others) it's probably generations away from being a possibility. But - and this where I can see a disconnect - we need to have plans in place for it according to today's rules/guidelines? Even knowing full well that the rules will almost certainly have changed before it becomes a possibility?

Is that approach logical at all?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:41Sun Jul 3 13:41:47 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 346

Those are the rules Greg.

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 15:10Sun Jul 3 15:10:24 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 341

Really, VoR? The rules say that when a club has just escaped relegation from Southern League Premier Division Central it needs to plan to meet the rules for EFL membership in the full knowledge that those rules will almost certainly have changed by the time the club has any chance of being in a position to apply them?

If you really think that's the case, I think you may have misunderstood what the rules actually say.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:47Sun Jul 3 13:47:23 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 339

You seem to have misunderstood the question.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 12:54Sun Jul 3 12:54:59 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 358

If the rules/regulations change after the plans are in place, it is then just a matter of adjustment rather than waiting to the last minute.
What is all this resistance to forward planning? We do it every day in our private lives.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:42Sun Jul 3 13:42:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 349

You cannot wait until the last minute...

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 15:15Sun Jul 3 15:15:58 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 338

OK - let's try once again the discussion we had when you first started discussing your master plan all those months ago. We have never been in the EFL. We have never realistically been close to joining the EFL. We are now further away from EFL membership than we have been for some time. Leaving planning for EFL until we are near the top of the division above our current position would still not be leaving it until the last minute, would it?

I made the offer back then, VoR, and I will make it again now (maybe with different numbers - I can't remember), and I will also make the same offer to animal. If you really think those plans are likely to be needed in the next ten years, let's have a bet. I say we won't need the plan before 2032 - and I will bet you a grand. Do you have enough confidence to back up your opinion with a grand?

Edited by Greg (NBFC) at 16:14:00 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:29Sun Jul 3 22:29:50 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 279

Whether they are needed or not, I would rather see a plan in place than just bumbling along. I have no idea where we will be in 10 years time, nor have I ever said that we WILL be in the EFL. But we could be, we might be.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 09:50Mon Jul 4 09:50:48 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 241

To be fair, within 10 years we could be heading for the Champions League next year. We could be, we might be. I would suggest that the odds of that are slightly - and I do actually mean slightly - lower than being in EFL Div 2. The likelihood of either is vanishingly small. If we are planning for Div 2 requirements, why not go the whole hog and have a plan in place for our Champions League winners' victory parade?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal4/7 09:54Mon Jul 4 09:54:09 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 237

You keep harping on about realism and come up with that?
I give up.
Time to revert to being a lurker.
Bye.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:01Mon Jul 4 10:01:15 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 240

Nice evasion of the point! Surely you must agree that planning past National League is highly unlikely to ever be needed, and that with the time it would take to get above that level we would probably be working to an entirely different set of guidelines to those in place now?

To link to a point in one of your posts further down, is there a difference between planning how to spend a £10 million lottery win or a £100 million lottery win? The chances of both are remote enough to make planning for either a rather pointless exercise. Still, if it keeps VoR busy then it could be a good thing!

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 10:12Mon Jul 4 10:12:11 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 232

For clarity;-

We have to plan for all future possibilities from Level/Step 10 through to Level/Step 3...that is our range.

That will make sure that our proud Club, with its strong history, is able to re-group & start again if we are asked to leave Liberty Way.

To be prepared...it will not cost anything, only time to work through that process.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue4/7 14:51Mon Jul 4 14:51:48 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 206

Be prepared for the realistic outcomes of ground tenancy issues, yes.
Be prepared for EFL while in Southern League? Nope.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:13Mon Jul 4 12:13:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 225

I have to say it again (and risk being shot down), but the club has gone bust twice in the last 30+ year (Kelly/shooter, Stadiasafe); nearly bust other times (George Best game, Post Thorne, Alan Prince time and others), been demoted from a league, faced above average point deductions........hardly "proud" and much of the success in this period was followed by demise (probably the reason for the success).

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:14Mon Jul 4 10:14:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 238

And my question, VoR, was why stop at Step 3? Why not plan right up to the highest possible level of club football in Europe?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 10:18Mon Jul 4 10:18:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 248

Because above Level/Step 3 (EFL League One), the requirement is for all-seater stadia & that is an unrealistic ambition for the Boro, unless as you say a millionaire comes knocking on JG's door or a loyal Boro fan wins the Lottery!

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:16Mon Jul 4 12:16:59 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 224

We need a millionaire to get into EFL, and probably conf national (or at least to stay for a short period)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 10:32Mon Jul 4 10:32:54 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 237

And there we have it - in a nutshell. Many - probably most - would say that sort of investment is needed to get us above National League, because going from NL to EFL would (sensibly) require us to go full time and have a bigger squad quite apart from the ground and facilities requirements.

We both agree that planning for some eventualities is pointless because of the level of investment required is unrealistic - we just disagree on where that line exists.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 11:15Mon Jul 4 11:15:26 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 242

For clarity:-

Entry into the EFL attracts significant funding from the EFL (which can help with the Stadium upgrade)...once a member club, the EFL provide funding each year ongoing...circa 50% of all EFL funding is provided by the Premier League.

The Stadium upgrade has grace periods...it is a very straightforward & sympathetic process.

It just needs a bit of work in the background at the Club, to realise how much money will be made available.

Edited by VoR at 11:15:55 on 4th July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)4/7 12:19Mon Jul 4 12:19:09 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 217

For clarity:-

Entry into the EFL attracts significant funding from the EFL for clubs that achieve EFL status....something that surely is a pipe-dream (unless a multi-millionaire comes along; in which case ground improvement would surely not be an issue (unless the Durham type model)

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 15:53Sun Jul 3 15:53:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 333

I have never been a gambler Greg.

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 16:16Sun Jul 3 16:16:14 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 328

So you don't have the confidence to back up your view with cash? Thought not.

From my point of view, of course, it isn't a gamble. If you're honest, even you will admit that the chances are massively against us reaching Div 2 within 10 years (or 20, or even 50) unless there are huge changes (such as millionaire backing).

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:48Sun Jul 3 13:48:26 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

I know.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:48Sun Jul 3 13:48:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

No one is saying wait until the last minute.

There are literally dozens of years between planning now and leaving it till the last minute.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:59Sun Jul 3 12:59:38 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

Last minute?
We have at least three years before we need to hit EFL entry criteria, and three more to improve to staying criteria.
That isn't last minute. As far as I can see, fro. What VOR says the only thing about the ground rhat is not ready for entry to EFL is the tenancy and the number of seats.

If we do not sort the tenancy, nothing else is required.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:44Sun Jul 3 13:44:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 349

...plus a floodlight upgrade. lol

REQUIRING PLANNING PERMISSION.

Edited by VoR at 13:45:34 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:03Sun Jul 3 13:03:25 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 356

So lets just wait for 6 years before we identify any problems?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:47Sun Jul 3 13:47:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 340

It's an involved exercise to painstakingly go through!

Time will pass very quickly!

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:08Sun Jul 3 13:08:33 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 367

No, we have identified THE problem.

Tackle that and see where we need to go from there.

What will be needed once the long-term home is settled will change massively depending on where it is.
If it is where we are, there will be smallish projects
If it is somewhere new, we will need to think about much bigger projects.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:49Sun Jul 3 13:49:18 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 341

That is what I want to discuss with JD, to offer my help.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:15Sun Jul 3 13:15:32 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 360

What will be needed once the long-term home is settled will change massively depending on where it is.
If it is where we are, there will be smallish projects
If it is somewhere new, we will need to think about much bigger projects.


And we should not plan for both eventualities so that we are ready for them?

It will take much more manpower and resources when it happens if we don't.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR4/7 00:43Mon Jul 4 00:43:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 280

Add ground-share into the mix...

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 13:52Sun Jul 3 13:52:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 349

That is what I want to discuss JD.

It can EITHER be a very rewarding & satisfying exercise OR a mad panic when the time comes...either way, there is a route to be followed...a way through...

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:56Sun Jul 3 13:56:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 351

Or the time will never come.

That is far more likely.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:19Sun Jul 3 13:19:40 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 356

Why not sort out which one is needed, then go for that?
Planning for the EFL is a can we can kick down the road for a couple of years, if not forever.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:26Sun Jul 3 13:26:04 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 351

Because if tenure fails we need a "plan b"
EFL is part of the long term planning and a way down the road. But we will have a good idea o thee issues and costs involved.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:28Sun Jul 3 13:28:41 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 359

Secure a home base with long term security is one plan.
Be it at LW, Greenmoor Road or the foothills of Mount Jud.

It is one project.

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:36Sun Jul 3 13:36:52 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 352

It is a part of the bigger picture. One step on the road.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:44Sun Jul 3 13:44:34 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 341

And the longest journey starts with a single step.

Let's take that step and see what direction we are facing.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:36Sun Jul 3 12:36:50 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 362

That is not agreeing with me.
It is the opposite.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 12:04Sun Jul 3 12:04:44 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 378

I think that he is saying that if it is in the Boro long term plan to be in the EFL, then they need to plan to have a suitable ground in place and not wait until the last minute.
By doing that they will have an insight in to the costs and issues involved.
Makes perfect sense to me

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

Edited by animal at 12:07:56 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:37Sun Jul 3 12:37:39 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 360

Step 1 of having a ground suitable for the EFL .... long term tenancy.


Step 2, nothing until that is secured.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 12:45Sun Jul 3 12:45:18 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 352

Completely correct. So now is the time to plan for it.
You have identified a problem to achieving the long term plan/ambition. So a solution needs to be found.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 12:53Sun Jul 3 12:53:34 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 346

I beleive the club are planning on fixing the problem about not having a long term tenancy.

Once they have done that, we can make plans for other relevant things.
Making the ground up to the standard required three years after winning promotion to the FL is not something we need to be planning for.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 12:59Sun Jul 3 12:59:23 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 358

So you're saying that you agree that to plan is sensible, as long as it meets with your approval?

"I beleive the club are planning on fixing the problem about not having a long term tenancy."
That is planning for the future! But why restrict it to just that one issue?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:02Sun Jul 3 13:02:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 347

It needs restricting to just one issue as the rest are pointless without it.

There is no point planning to do improvements to Liberty Way that may not need doing if we do not stay there.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:06Sun Jul 3 13:06:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 361

So we dont need to plan for not getting tenure at LW? Really?

Tenure is one, albeit important, step.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:11Sun Jul 3 13:11:21 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 351

VoR is talking about Improvements to LW.
That is all he has talked about.
That is a waste of time until we know we are staying.
Me saying we need to sortnout the long term future of our home includes planning for not staying at LW.
I have not said anything anywhere in this conversation about not trying to find an alternative hone to LW.
I have not even hinted that we do not need to look at alternative hones, which is why I am confused by your rhetorical question which you seem to have assumed an answer to.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:19Sun Jul 3 13:19:30 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

We are never going to agree, are we. I maintain that planning for any eventuality is sensible, and you maintain that we wait until the last minute.
I WOULD agree with you, but then we would both be wrong. :-)

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:22Sun Jul 3 13:22:02 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 351

I have never once said leave it till the last minute.
Never.

My entire point is that planning to get our home ready for the EFL is not a project that will be needed for many years, if ever, and the plans will be very different depending on where we are and what restrictions will be in place when it happens.


You are wrong, wrong, wrong to suggest that leaving it to the last minute is what I am suggesting.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

Edited by The_Hullablue at 13:22:45 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:31Sun Jul 3 13:31:22 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

My entire point is that planning to get our home ready for the EFL is not a project that will be needed for many years, if ever, and the plans will be very different depending on where we are and what restrictions will be in place when it happens.

That's called waiting.

You are wrong, wrong, wrong to suggest that leaving it to the last minute is what I am suggesting.

Certainly what you are projecting though. Not seen you say that planning for the future is a Good Thing.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:34Sun Jul 3 13:34:56 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 348

I have no problem with planning, but planning needs to be focused on reality.

Not planning for EFL entry now is not valued waiting, it is called planning more realistic and pressing projects.

At no point have I said "planning is bad", because that is insane.

What I have said is "planning on getting LW up to EFL status is a total and utter waste of time and effort."

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 14:08Sun Jul 3 14:08:47 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 342

Upon entry to the National, the Club have to demonstrate to the FA how they intend to upgrade LW to 5000 capacity, including 1000 seats.

By the end of the third year of continuous membership, they have to further upgrade LW to 5000 capacity, including 2000 seats.

The choice is not ours to make...

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 15:27Sun Jul 3 15:27:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 323

As we have already been in the National League, then surely we must have already shown those plans to the FA? If that's the case, can't we just park further discussion and tell the FA "the same as last time we were here"?

That would make your job the easiest task in Liberty Way.

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 14:21Sun Jul 3 14:21:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

Maybe the time to do the first bit is when we are in the National North.
Do we need to do anything new to meet that criteria, or have we already shown how we could do that when we were last members?

You keep repeating yourself yet never realising these are not things we need to plan for now, nor are they things we can plan for without securing a long-term home.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 14:35Sun Jul 3 14:35:00 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 344

The FA expect security of tenure to be guaranteed.

To demonstrate how we intend to upgrade LW to 5000 capacity, including 1000 seats, we need to provide the FA with a set of concept plans for a new 500-seater Main Stand.

We can add the proposed further extension(s) to that Stand in outline, to show how it can be increased to 2000 seats (assuming the existing 500-seater is either sold or demolished?).

We will also need to provide a copy of the NBBC Planning Permission, to upgrade the floodlights to 500 lux.

Yes, as long as we agree on the concept design early on, we can leave the Architectural work & the planning permission for the floodlight upgrade until we are promoted to the NLN.

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Re: Thing is...

By Gustavus3/7 14:43Sun Jul 3 14:43:05 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 327

How do we get security of tenure without getting the landowners to agree it?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:41Sun Jul 3 13:41:38 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 345

Planning is based on possibility, not realistic possibility.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue3/7 13:46Sun Jul 3 13:46:32 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 344

Everything is possible, much less is probable.

Boro winning Champions League in a dozen years is possible.
Boro still being a non league club in 12 years is far more probable.
Let's plan for the probable.

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 13:51Sun Jul 3 13:51:22 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 348

Goes hand in hand with planning for the possible.
Really going now.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 12:31Sun Jul 3 12:31:19 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 367

Exactly.

I will now expand the discussion...

Upon entry to the EFL, to attain/fulfil their 'Membership' requirements, by the 30th April in the third season of continuous membership, the minimum stadium requirement is 5000 capacity, including 2000 seats.

Effectively, if we remain at LW, the far side of the ground will need to be demolished & replaced with a 2000-seater stand.

It then gets very interesting!

Bear in mind that upon entry to the EFL, financial support starts to flow...

I've held back on this one! lol

Edited by VoR at 12:42:43 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 15:22Sun Jul 3 15:22:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 332

VoR - Boro has never been in the EFL, never even been realistically close. Planning for it is madness - do you really not see that? We are a semi-professional club. Every attempt at full time football has resulted in serious financial problems. Why would we even want to go down that path?

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Re: Thing is...

By animal3/7 22:35Sun Jul 3 22:35:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 273

I have never won the Lottery but keep buying the ticket in hope. That is also madness.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)4/7 09:57Mon Jul 4 09:57:06 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 235

Your analogy there is with completely the wrong thing, animal. I too buy the occasional lottery ticket. I would like to win, and occasionally allow my thoughts to drift on to what I may do with the money. That's a bit like Boro fans thinking promotion to Div 2 (and maybe above) would be an adventure.

Making the sort of plans VoR is talking about would be analogous to you getting in a consultant to arrange your investments for the potential win and, looking up prices for your tourist trip to space before you even know whether you will win (or even how much - £25 quid won't get you there).

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 16:03Sun Jul 3 16:03:03 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 318

This is the football environment that we find ourselves in & it is up to the Club's Owner to decide where our ambitions lie?

That said, the FA have put a framework in place to help with that decision.

Basically, you weigh up where you belong, based on what you can afford & what is sustainable in the long term.

The rules are clear.

The decision is yours...

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)3/7 17:11Sun Jul 3 17:11:14 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 304

Ambition - that says it all. Big difference to what can be achieved

Have a look at the club structure -

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 16:21Sun Jul 3 16:21:08 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 322

"The decision is yours"

If only that was the case lol.

We are what we are - a small to medium, part-time club. At a few times in our history we have been a large-ish part-time club. A couple of times we have been a failing full-time club. History shows that we have never been an achieving full-time club. Extrapolating that, given our current situation, I can see absolutely no justification for thinking we can make a go of being a full-time club surviving above even our most successful efforts to date. Why can we not just accept that - then if something changes we can start planning accordingly?

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)3/7 11:35Sun Jul 3 11:35:53 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 376

I thought it was too good to be true :(

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR3/7 11:40Sun Jul 3 11:40:24 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 381

We need to plan ahead...& a long way ahead.

You know very well what I am driving at!

Edit:

The FA are currently looking for suitably qualified people, to act as advisors to the numerous leagues & clubs within the NLS (National League System)...the non-league pryramid.

Enough said?

Edited by VoR at 12:03:50 on 3rd July 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 18:08Thu Jun 30 18:08:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 535

EFL - Really? Took FGR with their £1,000,000 long enough.

Let me get this right...
Money needs to be spent on a ground to get it to EFL standard, but that's okay because when in EFL money is available to get the ground to standard.

You know money to survive in the EFL is needed; far more than to survive in the National league.

Perhaps Boro' should start building now because when they play Arsenal at the Emeritz that money would pay for the improvements. Lets not get silly and think of the 4th round tie at Old Trafford.


Yes, staying at Liberty way would be best.
- Its just about good enough for National.
- It can be expanded, but that takes money. If EFL was even a remote possibility there would be people involved with that money.

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 18:09:46 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 18:20Thu Jun 30 18:20:59 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 535

Member clubs in the EFL receive payments from the EFL each season.

Nearly half of the money distributed comes from the Premier League.

Edit:

Google 'Premier League 2019- 2022 funding for EFL clubs'.

There is an infographic that you can look at, for each of the 72 clubs, that I'm sure will interest you...it's on the Premier League website.

Edited by VoR at 18:29:54 on 30th June 2022
Edited by VoR at 18:31:15 on 30th June 2022

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A small and minor problem

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 19:01Thu Jun 30 19:01:17 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 553

To get this money a club has to be promoted to the FL, and that require big bucks.

Thankfully, no club in FL has run into financial problems (if you exclude just about every club and that’s ignoring the likes of Macclesfield, Bury, Kidderminster, Scarborough, Maidstone, Doncaster, Torquay, Yeovil ….

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: A small and minor problem

By VoR30/6 23:42Thu Jun 30 23:42:20 2022In response to A small and minor problem Top of thread

Views: 525

I remember sitting in the owners office at Chesterfield all of those years ago, listening to him describe his experiences in football.

He was in his late 70's & had realised that the point in his life had come when it was time to sell & give up his beloved football club...it was one of the most rewarding & humbling experiences of my life.

I had gone to meet him, along with Rollo Reid of Reidsteel & we both sat there for two hours, doing him the courtesy of listening to him recount his life story, the trials & tribulations of following his passion, the highs & lows of being such a prominent figure in the local community, including explanations of the abuse he had taken over many years, by not giving in to the fans demands/thirst for success & sticking by his philosophy of not running his famous football club into debt & yet still giving the loyal fans of Chesterfield something to cheer about...

Just imagine it, this gentleman, Rollo Reid (a very well educated gentleman, who has worked all over the world & speaks SEVEN languages fluently) & me!...what right did I have to be there, sitting in such illustrious company.

All that said, I was there at his invitation to help him out.

He wanted to know how much a new 10k capacity football ground would cost at a site on the ring road, at Wheeldon Mill, to help him better understand the prospective new owners proposals...he still felt it was his duty to protect his Club, even when he had left the scene...we duly put the effort in & came up with the goods & he was very thankful.

Sometimes in life, you have to do things that can bring no financial reward, because you understand another person's circumstances & out of respect, you know you can help them out & give them some peace of mind & some closure in their lives...that can be very rewarding in a spiritual sense.

Coming back now to your point VS, he told us that, at that time, only NINE clubs in the entire Football League were trading solvently & were not in debt & Chesterfield were one of them...he was so very proud of that achievement, despite the constant criticism from the supporters for not throwing money at chasing success.

He believed clubs over-valued their playing squad, as assets, to mask their financial problems.

Chesterfield's iconic old ground was tucked in among the terraced houses, a place full of character, just like the man we were sitting with...this is just one of the tales I can tell you about the people involved in our national game, people I have met over the years.

They all have one thing in common...they are dreamers & they have a vision in a truly wonderful sport.

Edited by VoR at 23:43:04 on 30th June 2022

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Re: A small and minor problem

By Gustavus1/7 16:47Fri Jul 1 16:47:13 2022In response to Re: A small and minor problem Top of thread

Views: 458

They may say you’re a dreamer … but you’re not the only one!

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1 person likes this 1 person

Re: A small and minor problem

By VoR1/7 17:04Fri Jul 1 17:04:15 2022In response to Re: A small and minor problem Top of thread

Views: 432

There's a lot of reality/focus to go through first to make dreams happen! lol

That's the wonder of football...that's why people are drawn to the game...escapism in dreams...it's most evident in football club owners...it's unique!

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Re: Thing is...

By The_Hullablue30/6 18:05Thu Jun 30 18:05:46 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 540

I do not beleive that to be the best option at all, let alone "by far".

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How bright should floodlights be in the Conference?

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Re: Thing is...

By Vernon Slain30/6 18:11Thu Jun 30 18:11:16 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 515

Hear Hear.

63--13--12--38--73--117= 50*/189

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Re: Thing is...

By animal30/6 09:08Thu Jun 30 09:08:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 587

Maybe they saw that his experience could help the club move forward? Maybe his posts stood out in the sea of the usual posts?

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 09:05Thu Jun 30 09:05:33 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 573

Another opinion?

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 09:43Thu Jun 30 09:43:29 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 558

okay, but as I said........ You have missed a very minor point........ £££££££££££££££s

If the club stays at Liberty Way, the ££££££££££££s becomes ££s

=== I am a 1 in 10

Edited by VS Boro at 09:46:00 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By animal30/6 08:41Thu Jun 30 08:41:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 575

You do realise that regardless of the merits of your involvement there will be a significant number of old guard supporters on here that will maintain a negative stance?
It is not sour grapes, it is just that a long list of management has spurned the offer of help and involvement in the past. Their focus was solely on the money that they could access with fan involvement. When they realised that they would need to grant the fans a say, their interest rapidly waned.
I for one can see that your experience could help the management in planning a course for the future development of the club, whether this will be at LW or elsewhere.
It will be interesting to see if history repeats itself or if the current management are any different.

Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana .....
je pense, donc je suis

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 08:45Thu Jun 30 08:45:18 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 585

Fair comment.

Let's just say that I am hopeful.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 09:00Thu Jun 30 09:00:10 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 573

Just two examples I experienced.

All clubs were (as now traditional) doing something for "non-league day". The secretary was approached and curtly said "why should the club lose money by reducing prices"

The coop was once told whilst trying to get more involvement...... "I see Bath City supporters have raised £x,000; When Nuneaton supporters do the same then come back"

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 01:54Thu Jun 30 01:54:45 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 634

Surely this knowledge has been in place given the five-year-plan and the ground situation has been known about for ages

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 02:29Thu Jun 30 02:29:27 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 633

As I understand it, gaining promotion to the EFL League Two is a lucrative business & the EFL are there to give clubs as much help & advice as they need...

The rest is down to the clubs.

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)30/6 08:24Thu Jun 30 08:24:02 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 582

Not what I am saying.
Given everything we are told/know I am amazed there has not been someone

II can explain what is required & how stadium design is developed at the various levels within the pyramid & how you plan for continuing development, all in accordance with the relevant design guides & legislation...& as an aside, why we have ended up with what we have at Liberty Way.

With that knowledge, the Club can then set its own targets/plan accordingly.


=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By Greg (NBFC)30/6 06:13Thu Jun 30 06:13:51 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 635

All pipe dreams - realistic or otherwise - have a fantasy upside and a fantasy downside.

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Re: Thing is...

By VoR30/6 07:33Thu Jun 30 07:33:57 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 606

Yes Greg, you are right but what I intend to do here is to cover the whole spectrum...from membership of League One (Level 3/Step 3) right down to the Griff's league (Level 10/Step 10) & then take the journey back up through the Pyramid from Step 10...cover all bases.

I want the Club to know everything possible that they need to know to deal with their ongoing planning for the next 15 years, including trying to build infrastructure.

If it goes well, we (the fans) will need to think about how we can help the Club to apply for grants, so that is where good people such as yourself might want to get involved again?

...& of course, it goes without saying, how the Supporters Co-op can have a role in all of this...yes, it will be a challenge but it is a very straightforward process, all that is required is a properly reasoned structure to the Club's off-field stuff, based on a realistic expectation/ambition.

Once they have the detailed knowledge of how it all works, they can then make informed decisions on where we go as a Club.

I can also make recommendations on specialists to approach for help, if needed...the likes of Reidsteel & Hewitt Sportsturf...& Consultants, if needed...& of course Philips lighting/Thorn lighting!

There will be a lot to get through but I am sure it will be worthwhile...from my brief telephone conversation with Jason yesterday, they are eager/willing to learn everything there is to know...that's very encouraging for me...

To the future, lets's hope it's bright, let's hope it's blue & white!...(sorry for that, I couldn't resist it!).

UTB.

Edited by VoR at 07:34:35 on 30th June 2022

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)29/6 22:09Wed Jun 29 22:09:47 2022In response to Re: Thing is...Top of thread

Views: 668

If only the club had a supporters coop/trust.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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Re: Thing is...

By VS Town (VS Boro)29/6 21:42Wed Jun 29 21:42:39 2022In response to Thing is...Top of thread

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Sums it up perfectly.

=== I am a 1 in 10

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